The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by Follix » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:57 am

Does it really matters tho?

I mean The Wall is not known for amazing piano/keyboard work compared to the 3 albums before.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by DarkSideFreak » Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:40 pm

Wolfpack wrote:
And I think Gilmour should be able to hear from the final mix, how much Wright is in there.
And maybe not only Gilmour, but also some fans.

What contributions did Wright do for 'The Wall',
that are obviously an addition and obviously his style?
To me, the only part that sounds like Wright doing 'his' thing is the solo in Run Like Hell. Everything else is pretty anonymous. Listen to the keyboards on David's first solo album - David could easily replicate Rick's background parts. I don't doubt that Rick played on most The Wall songs, but he did so in the manner of a studio musician, much like Andy Bown played the organ on TFC. Live it was a completely different thing and Rick put his stamp on songs like ABITW 1 or Goodbye Blue Sky.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by DarkSideFreak » Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:47 pm

mastaflatch wrote:I don't think that Clare Torry should have been credited for GGITS although she should have been given a fair amount of money for her performance. it's a performance for the ages, it's a classic but she didn't alter the original composition, she sang a vocal solo on it.
But her solo was more or less intact any time the band played the song live - all the singers who did the song listened to the original version first so the solo did become a part of the song eventually. And the exact same thing goes for "Money" and "Another Brick II", both songs have a solo that's like a composition itself, very well-built and in many ways, iconic. Had they released Roger's demo version of "Money" or "Another Brick" without the guitar solo, they would not have been hits.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by mastaflatch » Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:53 pm

DarkSideFreak wrote:
mastaflatch wrote:I don't think that Clare Torry should have been credited for GGITS although she should have been given a fair amount of money for her performance. it's a performance for the ages, it's a classic but she didn't alter the original composition, she sang a vocal solo on it.
But her solo was more or less intact any time the band played the song live - all the singers who did the song listened to the original version first so the solo did become a part of the song eventually. And the exact same thing goes for "Money" and "Another Brick II", both songs have a solo that's like a composition itself, very well-built and in many ways, iconic. Had they released Roger's demo version of "Money" or "Another Brick" without the guitar solo, they would not have been hits.
I agree with you, those solos "made" those songs but it's just not how songwriting works in rock'n'roll. I mean, the importance of the solos is tremendous for many of us but it's still subjective. Had the solos been uninspired and full of errors, would they have been worth a credit too? And how about the keyboard arrangements? The memorable drum patterns? They are arrangements. Had Gilmour came up with the descending bass riff in the middle of Money, he would have deserved a credit for it but soloing on top of a riff is not considered more than an arrangement.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by Hudini » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:01 pm

mastaflatch wrote:Had Gilmour came up with the descending bass riff in the middle of Money, he would have deserved a credit for it
Hadn't Gilmour come up with the time signature change in the middle of Money?

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by jtull » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:30 pm

I remember, I think it was on the "Making of Dark Side Of The Moon" DVD, Gilmour said it was someone other in the band(Roger, Rick or Nick?) who suggested time signature change in the middle of Money. He said something like "they suggested it probably to do my job easier for me".

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by manonthemoog » Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:37 am

I always thought that Nobody Home sounds a lot like Rick's playing although some of the licks are a bit faster than he usually plays

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by snifferdog » Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:50 pm

As far as I know, Bob Ezrin played piano on Nobody Home.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by mabewa » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:11 am

mastaflatch wrote:
Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:53 pm
DarkSideFreak wrote: But her solo was more or less intact any time the band played the song live - all the singers who did the song listened to the original version first so the solo did become a part of the song eventually. And the exact same thing goes for "Money" and "Another Brick II", both songs have a solo that's like a composition itself, very well-built and in many ways, iconic. Had they released Roger's demo version of "Money" or "Another Brick" without the guitar solo, they would not have been hits.
I agree with you, those solos "made" those songs but it's just not how songwriting works in rock'n'roll. I mean, the importance of the solos is tremendous for many of us but it's still subjective. Had the solos been uninspired and full of errors, would they have been worth a credit too? And how about the keyboard arrangements? The memorable drum patterns? They are arrangements. Had Gilmour came up with the descending bass riff in the middle of Money, he would have deserved a credit for it but soloing on top of a riff is not considered more than an arrangement.
I agree. Solos, no matter how good, usually don't result in songwriting credits. If you make up chord progressions or riffs, you should get credit, but soloing over chord progressions or riffs, no matter how good is a different story.

By the same token, I don't think that Clare Torrey should have gotten credit for 'Great Gig,' as she was essentially improvising. Granted, the band's backing singers usually follow her parts exactly, but then again, many of Roger's guitarists have followed Dave's solos pretty closely too.

That said, on the topic of the Wall, while I don't think that Rick should have gotten credit for something like the solo on Run Like Hell (as good as it is), I have heard that Bob Ezrin made up the classical guitar segment to 'Is There Anybody Out There,' and if that's true, he deserves songwriting credit for it. That's an entire piece of music, not just a solo. I've also heard the argument that Rick should have been credited for the intro of Sheep, and I tend to agree. It's not just a keyboard solo--it's also a piece of music with chords, and the jazzy chords really don't sound like anything Roger ever wrote by himself.

So basically, while I don't buy the argument that David or Rick should have gotten credit on The Wall for their solos, I do think that it's likely that Roger got more possessive about songwriting credits as time went on, resulting in some cases where songs that would have been credited to more than one member in the band's early days ended up being credited to only him.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by mabewa » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:20 am

DarkSideFreak wrote:
Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:40 pm
Wolfpack wrote:
And I think Gilmour should be able to hear from the final mix, how much Wright is in there.
And maybe not only Gilmour, but also some fans.

What contributions did Wright do for 'The Wall',
that are obviously an addition and obviously his style?
To me, the only part that sounds like Wright doing 'his' thing is the solo in Run Like Hell. Everything else is pretty anonymous. Listen to the keyboards on David's first solo album - David could easily replicate Rick's background parts. I don't doubt that Rick played on most The Wall songs, but he did so in the manner of a studio musician, much like Andy Bown played the organ on TFC. Live it was a completely different thing and Rick put his stamp on songs like ABITW 1 or Goodbye Blue Sky.
I mostly agree. Even as late as Animals, almost all the keyboard parts sound like something that could only be Rick, but much of The Wall besides Run Like Hell is not very distinctively him. He plays some pretty fine stuff (like the organ on the ABitW PT II solo and pretty much everything on Hey You), but it's not something that sounds like only Rick could have played.

The only thing I can say is that the parts attributed to him by Fitch and Mahon is that they do sound like Rick--just not like something that only he would play.

It's interesting to me that on the two new AMLOR remixes we've heard so far, the new organ parts sound VERY Rick, more so than most of what we hear on The Wall, and the parts attributed to him on Division Bell and Endless River also sound much more distinctively Rick than anything on The Wall. It's not that I don't believe Fitch and Mahon--I think they probably got everything correct--but it does lend credence to the claim that Rick wasn't at his best when The Wall was recorded. He was able to play some good stuff, but he wasn't playing with his usual inspiration and originality.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by ChillOnTheSun » Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:37 am

Composer can give credits to other contributors in percentage. That is the reason why Wright should be credited for instance in Sheep for the intro. It is so recognazable and played only by him. Shine On is divided to the parts, so that's the reason why Wright is only author of part 1. The same applies e. g. for song Cirrus Minor. The second instrumental part of it should be credited to Wright. As very recognazable chord sequence or atmosphere. And in PF music player should be credited also to the atmosphere stuff as the MOST recognazable part of PF song.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by Annoying Twit » Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:23 am

mabewa wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:11 am
By the same token, I don't think that Clare Torrey should have gotten credit for 'Great Gig,' as she was essentially improvising. Granted, the band's backing singers usually follow her parts exactly, but then again, many of Roger's guitarists have followed Dave's solos pretty closely too.
I think there's a difference between a solo that is part of a larger song, and a song/track length solo. If Clare Torrey had only created a short solo in a track where the distinctive/memorable part of the track wasn't her solo, then I wouldn't think she deserved a credit. But, given that her solo lasts the vast majority of the track, and is the real memorable/distinctive part of the composition, I feel that she deserves the credit.

Usually her parts are recreated exactly. But, on Roger's latest tour the singers seemed to improvise from scratch, following the same style but not her notes. In my opinion (which I don't expect others to accept as fact - it's an opinion) the result wasn't very good, and for me this was the low point in the US+Them film.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by mabewa » Fri Nov 29, 2019 7:51 am

ChillOnTheSun wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:37 am
Composer can give credits to other contributors in percentage. That is the reason why Wright should be credited for instance in Sheep for the intro. It is so recognazable and played only by him. Shine On is divided to the parts, so that's the reason why Wright is only author of part 1. The same applies e. g. for song Cirrus Minor. The second instrumental part of it should be credited to Wright. As very recognazable chord sequence or atmosphere. And in PF music player should be credited also to the atmosphere stuff as the MOST recognazable part of PF song.
Very well put! Roger could have easily given Rick, say, 20% of Sheep, or even 15%. Rick obviously wasn't the main author of the song, but it's hard to imagine it without those electric piano parts.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by Kerry King » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:31 am

mabewa wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 7:51 am
Roger could have easily given Rick, say, 20% of Sheep, or even 15%.
Interesting that Waters would be "giving" the percentage of the publishing to Wright, as opposed to Wright "taking" what was rightfully his as the keyboardist/original member of pink floyd. Seems to be a case of dominance and submission.

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Re: The truth about Rick Wright's contribution on The Wall

Post by mabewa » Sat Nov 30, 2019 9:10 am

Kerry King wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:31 am
mabewa wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 7:51 am
Roger could have easily given Rick, say, 20% of Sheep, or even 15%.
Interesting that Waters would be "giving" the percentage of the publishing to Wright, as opposed to Wright "taking" what was rightfully his as the keyboardist/original member of pink floyd. Seems to be a case of dominance and submission.
Good point. In the past it might have been 'If you want to use my cool keyboard intro thing, you have to give me credit,' but it might have been like 'I'm taking all the credit for this song, and if you don't agree, I'll just slice off your nice part off the song and they'll be less of you on the album.' Nick reported that Roger told him around the time of Final Cut that Roger told him that whatever he did was 'just drumming,' he was definitely getting no songwriting credits on the album.

Granted, just coming up with a drum part usually isn't reason for a credit, but in the past, Mason came up with drum parts that were part of the composition of the song, and thus got credits. Pretty sure that's where his credits on Sum/Skins came from.