There will be a new album

All discussion related specifically to Roger Waters.
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danielcaux
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Re: There will be a new album

Post by danielcaux » Thu Jun 08, 2017 3:54 pm

Yeah, the production of both albums is so different, they wouldn't mix very well in a Frankenstein project. And honestly, ITTLTWRW really doesn't need it, it flows nicely on its own.

That's one of the things I didn't like from RTL, the album has some nice bits, but has no flow at all, it's more lika a collection of unrelated songs, with some nice instrumentals sprinkled around, but the whole thing doesn't quite gel into a cohesive album experience. So maybe if you take the best pieces of RTL and OAI it would make a decent single album: ROTALI?

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And then...

What else to round it up?

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Annoying Twit » Thu Jun 08, 2017 4:52 pm

danielcaux wrote:Yeah, the production of both albums is so different, they wouldn't mix very well in a Frankenstein project. And honestly, ITTLTWRW really doesn't need it, it flows nicely on its own.

That's one of the things I didn't like from RTL, the album has some nice bits, but has no flow at all, it's more lika a collection of unrelated songs, with some nice instrumentals sprinkled around, but the whole thing doesn't quite gel into a cohesive album experience. So maybe if you take the best pieces of RTL and OAI it would make a decent single album: ROTALI?

Castellhorizon
OAI
A boat lies waiting
Smile
Beauty
And then...

What else to round it up?
That's a very laid back album you've designed there. Are you enjoying Brian Eno's latest album?

Hmmm... No Pocket Full of Stones, No In Any Tongue. I think I could make a ROTALI that has almost no overlap with yours. And then... may be my favourite DG solo instrumental, however.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Annoying Twit » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:01 pm

@raisemyrent - I do hear a lot of Floyd in DG's albums. However, it's not a continuation of TDB, as you point out. It's more a continuation of WYWH, with very little reference to Animals-The Wall-Final Cut Floyd. For me it's hard to imagine PF continuing after TFC, as that's a Rog album. It is interesting though that DG frequently uses that hammer on acoustic guitar that's a Rog trademark, even as far back as Murder.

I see AMLoR more as a development of AF than Floyd. TDB has the SOYCD Pt. 1-2 bits, and some RLH guitar/HAC bits, but I think the albums true inspiration is pre-DSotM albums like LV.

Faces of Stone/Dancing Right In Front Of Me etc. could fit onto TDB quite well I think.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by raisemyrent » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:10 pm

Yeah I missed those 2. Raisemyrent (duh!) could do though subpar maybe. Like a proto marooned. Take a breath tries but I'm glad it wasn't a Floyd tune.
It is a different sound.
Roger also took a bit of an about face (lol) going to back to more direct quoting from the classics, as opposed to an evolved wall sound (though a lot is still there). Still looking for some rationale for that though I suspect pressure from Goodrich.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by danielcaux » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:47 pm

Annoying Twit wrote:That's a very laid back album you've designed there. Are you enjoying Brian Eno's latest album?
Well, I think "laid back" is what Gilmour does best. I'm a Pillow of Winds lover and a Young Lust hater. When Gilmour tries to do the angry or serious/somber thing it almost always sucks, like in Take A Breath or Faces Of Stone and In Any Tongue.

Haven't heard Eno's latest. Is it any good?

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Annoying Twit » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:52 pm

danielcaux wrote:
Annoying Twit wrote:That's a very laid back album you've designed there. Are you enjoying Brian Eno's latest album?
Well, I think "laid back" is what Gilmour does best. I'm a Pillow of Winds lover and a Young Lust hater. When Gilmour tries to do the angry or serious/somber thing it almost always sucks, like in Take A Breath or Faces Of Stone and In Any Tongue.

Haven't heard Eno's latest. Is it any good?
I like Young Lust, Faces of Stone, and In Any Tongue. However, I don't really like Take A Breath. I think it's the worst track on OAI.

I think Eno's latest album, 'Reflection' is very good. It's a return to Thursday Afternoon / Neroli style full CD length highly ambient music. It is VERY laid back.

While reactions to some of these albums are mixed, I think there is so much good music coming out in 2017. E.g. I think the new Erasure album is the best thing they've done for decades. Though, that's VERY non-Floydian.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by vizor » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:54 pm

"the Roger stuff is very clearly the direction pink Floyd would've gone had he still been around. It is actually the same direction (more like musical dead end) it went at the end of the 70s. At the same time, I don't really hear any floyd in the Gilmour solo albums."

So they need each other.

Without that, Dave makes music he can, and Roger comes out with this. Neither of them I can really listen too much of, nor most of Barrett solo stuff. They all have their moments, but they really just needed to chill out, gone for help and have lots of faith. Best anyone can do, we know what happened without.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by raisemyrent » Thu Jun 08, 2017 6:12 pm

I don't know. I see Roger as a musical dead end. I think at the risk of stating the obvious that this was made very clear between 77-82, and there was literally nothing else that could come out of those guys and be good (throw Wright out for good measure). I just don't see anything close to the TDB sessions coming to be with Roger around. I also don't see pink Floyd being about general themes and relatively abstract concepts anymore. Clear, heavily politicised messages instead is what I see.
I don't know. Maybe Roger would've grabbed all those musical bits and shaped them into something cohesive. Maybe not...

Aside. Roger dumped on Wright for not being prolific enough and having personal issues, and then took 25 years off. Let's not forget he said he would issue an album throughout; it wasn't an unexpected comeback.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by vizor » Thu Jun 08, 2017 7:45 pm

Yea there could be some truth to that Roger knew that back as far as 75/76 (of thier decreasing lifespan as recording artists) when he was comandeering the Animals recordings. Trying to make the appearance that they were all his doing. Then with the ensuing tour in which he was audibally counting each show knowing that there were illicit recordings being made. All this unknownst to the other band members, Rogers behavior was calculated to appear vehement and fed up with the whole business, only to TA-DA! unleash The Wall as the 'choice' to the other band members as to the next project. Does anybody really believe he just spit on a patron and it wasn't a setup between him and a paid show-worker with an NDA? Stunts. Gimmicks. The release of the Pig, the bringing of Syd into the WYWH session at the precise moment. Roy Harper - a singer brought in because Roger couldn't do it????? ? On and on.

Roger's gift to the group was to amp the speed and terror in the recordings. They are what made Pink Floyd sickening, and we all loved to be made sick and scared. Pink Floyd at its best was like a trippy, well-designed spookhouse on Halloween. We were safe because we knew we would leave when the record was over... when the drug wore off.

So if there's any truth that Roger knew that Pink Floyd's shelf-life was about over, he was right enough while assembling The Wall recordings with more stunts like bringing in Ezrin, additional musicians, and even engineering the ousting of Rick. Fodder for sensationalization. Didn't I see a foul marking on the original record sleeve "as performed by Pink Floyd"? I dont remember, but my impression of that release when it happened was that it was confusing, out of order, had lyrics and songs printed on it that weren't in the record. It was imperfect. And for somebody as controlling as Roger was being, he fucked up. Ha ha. Trying to outdo DSOTM? Close, but no cigar.

He was right enough while assembling The Wall recordings, but shortsighted in that he didn't know himself enough to forsee that someday he would yearn to be back in the group. Years of looking at the old footage and listening to the illicite recordings that he once 'detested', all to show his error and hypocrisy. And his lost youth.

So what did this really cost? We lost the years of their mid-thirties in which they could have released material in the prime of their lives. All because (if there really is any truth in this) Roger said so. Time up. Pink Floyd is over.

But that's not the deal he and the rest made with the recording industry when they hungrily signed on. That's why we want more. Anything. Even Roger clearing his throat. (gag)

I love the good of what he's done. I just don't have to like the person.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Jimi Dean Barrett » Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:02 pm

^ [-D-]
Well put, vizor!

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Annoying Twit » Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:48 pm

The Final Cut showed that the four piece PF was over. Both in Rick not being there and with it not really being a band anymore. Roger wanted to do what Roger wanted to do, and he's perfectly within his rights to do that. I don't think we were denied anything; The classic PF was over.

In some ways, we ended up getting more PF (non-classic) because of Roger leaving and Dave/Nick/Rick deciding to see/who what they could do without him. AMLoR is far from my favourite PF album, but it has some good songs on it. (Perhaps equivalent to More in that respect, but not so interesting.) TDB is a great album, and ER too. We also got tours and live albums that we wouldn't have otherwise, and I wonder if DG would have released his solo albums (tours, live DVDs etc.) if he hadn't continued with PF. Maybe he could have released more, but I'm far from sure. I also think they would have been different albums.

We're still getting PF-related product even this month, and of high quality too. Not equal to PF's peak of (in my opinion) DSotM - WYWH - Animals, but then how many albums reach those heights? How does ITTWTYW? compare to Music from the Body, or TATPACOH, or RK? In my opinion it's better than any of those, and I'm still thinking about how it compares to ATD and TFC.

I think we're really lucky to be getting what we are getting. And I'm personally pleased that I can appreciate that product without being upset that it's not quite the same as some imagined product that we could be getting in an imaginary world where things are different.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by raisemyrent » Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:10 pm

Well said. Roger being solo results in that he tours a lot (relatively speaking) too, so it allows for some pink Floyd to be within reach, which is better than nothing.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by Kerry King » Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:56 am

raisemyrent wrote:Roger being solo results in that he tours a lot (relatively speaking) too, so it allows for some pink Floyd to be within reach, which is better than nothing.
Naturally I disagree. Bad Pink Floyd music is not better than no Pink Floyd music. It's like having a delicious supper and then being served shit pie for dessert. Ruins the meal.

(Get your hands off my filthy dessert!)

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by danielcaux » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:35 am

Ironically, that's exactly why Roger Wanted Pink Floyd to stop. To avoid tarnishing the legacy with subpar "Pink Floyd" releases. He realized that the creative partnership that made Pink Floyd was over. He even offered Gilmour to release The Final Cut as a solo album. And then after nothing really happening in the band for two years he finally called it quits. But oh no, the money making machine was too good for Gilmour to let it die. And yet, it's Roger who is portrayed as the greedy bad guy. Go figure.

That said, it's interesting to imagine what would have happened it Roger hadn't quit in 1985 and had remained as Pink Floyd default leader. Probably we just would have got some more Floyd sounding versions of Radio KAOS and Amused To Death. But no AMLOR or TDB. Who knows... was Gilmour trying to do something with Pink Floyd from 1984 to 1985? Did Roger reject any ideas or killed any momentum for a new PF project during that period? I don't think so. The band was pretty much dead. Wright was with Zee doing crap music, Dave was on his own doing crap music, and Nick well, he was doing his thing, riding on some other artists train. It was actually Roger quitting what sparked the ambition in Gilmour's slacker heart and motivated him to prove himself as the new band leader/tyrant. A position he still strongly holds today. He became Mr. Pink Floyd since then. And then 9 years later when he was fed up with it, instead of quitting the band (he learned from Waters' mistake) he remained in power and just decided to kill any kind of activity within them.

Anyway, Vizor, is your post meant to be ironic or do you really believe all that conspiracy stuff?? I really can't tell!
Last edited by danielcaux on Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: There will be a new album

Post by raisemyrent » Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:31 am

True. Just throwing a bone out here. I'm with Gilmour. No new art, no real reason to tour. Odd to read these comments, as it was Roger who toured for 25 years with nothing to show for it (and sometimes straight up lip synching). Nobody wants to be the Rolling Stones, but maybe a few highlight concerts or a farewell (especially after Wright passed( would've been nice.