Pink Floyd - The Wall

Discussions about Pink Floyd and Solo Official Album CDs and DVDs.

Rate This Album

5 - Best
69
55%
4
30
24%
3
14
11%
2
5
4%
1 - Worst
7
6%
 
Total votes: 125

ZiggyZipgun
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by ZiggyZipgun »

space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 1:04 pmQuite simply, much more media attention was paid to Pink Floyd and AMLOR, than to Roger and his KAOS. Which is completely logical in my opinion.
"Learning to Fly" was the #1 for three weeks straight, "On the Turning Away" was also #1, and even "One Slip" reached #5. "Radio Waves" peaked at #12, and "Sunset Strip" at #15. I tend to believe that people simply enjoyed the Floyd tracks more than Roger's, so yes, it is logical that they received better media coverage - but Roger was still getting plenty of coverage. If his music was somehow better in any way, it would have been reflected somewhere.
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Annoying Twit
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:42 am I believe this: Because of The Final Cut is billed as "A requiem for the post-war dream by Roger Waters, performed by Pink Floyd." a lot of people have subconsciously accepted TFC as Roger Waters solo album. The Piper at the Gates of Dawn is as dominated by Syd Barrett as is TFC is by Roger Waters, yet no one ever calls ‘Piper’ for Syd Barrett’s solo album. But, if The Piper at the Gates of Dawn was billed as for example: A requiem for the Arnold Layne by Syd Barrett, performed by Pink Floyd, then the album would be considered forever as Syd Barrett’s solo album.

Well, it's a true that TFC is strong dominated by Roger Waters, but still the three of four members of Pink Floyd performed on the album.To me personally, sometimes The Wal seems like more of a Roger Waters solo album, than The Final Cut.
I think my, and many other people's, acceptance of TFC as essentially a Roger Waters solo album is a fully conscious decision based on observable facts.
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by ZiggyZipgun »

space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:42 amThe Piper at the Gates of Dawn is as dominated by Syd Barrett as is TFC is by Roger Waters, yet no one ever calls ‘Piper’ for Syd Barrett’s solo album.
☝️ This really is a ridiculous statement.

Piper is dominated by Rick's Farfisa as much as it is by Syd's songwriting and guitar. Their sound at the time revolved around that organ. Case in point: Barrett's solo albums; Dave and Rick both play the Hammond on various tracks, but in those instances it sounds much more like the songs on Atom Heart Mother than anything on Piper or Saucerful of Secrets*.

* Try it - my go-to playlist has:
1. Atom Heart Mother Suite
2. Effervescing Elephant
3. If
4. Waving My Arms in the Air/I Never Lied to You
5. Summer '68
6. Dominoes
7. Fat Old Sun
8. Baby Lemonade
9. Explosion (major key version of Careful With That Axes, from Early Years)
10. Gigolo Aunt
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space triangle
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by space triangle »

ZiggyZipgun wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 1:42 pm☝️ This really is a ridiculous statement.
No. Not at all, Ziggy. Just take a look:

1."Astronomy Domine"

Music: Barrett
Lyrics: Barrett


2, "Lucifer Sam"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett


3. "Matilda Mother"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett
and Wright

4. "Flaming"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett


5. "The Gnome"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett


6. "Chapter 24"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett


7. "The Scarecrow"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett


8. "Bike"

Lyrics/music: Barrett
Vocals by: Barrett



plus: 9.,10 "Pow R. Toc H.", "Interstellar Overdrive": Barrett, Waters, Mason. Wright

11. "Take Up Thy Stethoscope and Walk"

Lyrics/music: Waters
Vocals by: Waters

90% of the TPATGOD album was written by Syd Barrett. If The Finl Cut is Roger's solo album, then 'Piper' is Syd's solo album as well.
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 2:59 pm 90% of the TPATGOD album was written by Syd Barrett. If The Finl Cut is Roger's solo album, then 'Piper' is Syd's solo album as well.
First, 90% of the songwriting is less than 100% of the songwriting.

Secondly, what makes TFC essentially a Rog solo album is not just the songwriting. It's the amount of artistic control Rog exercised over the process. How the recording and production happened. This is very different between TFC and TPatGoD.

If TFC the other members of PF were treated pretty much as session musicians. The same does not apply to TPatGoD.
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by ZiggyZipgun »

There were all sorts of arguments over political issues, and I didn’t share his political views. But I never, never wanted to stand in the way of him expressing the story of The Final Cut. I just didn’t think some of the music was up to it.” - Gilmour, 2000

In a more typical band situation, the people involved are making music that they like. Successful session musicians are those that can fill a role within the music, whether it appeals to them or not. Syd, Nick, Rick, and Roger all contributed their own tastes to Piper, and they were all proud of it. Syd even bought a copy of Relics (in 1971) and was very proud of the fact that it made the Top 10 charts. Dave wanted more time to come up with some musical ideas for The Final Cut, because what they were working with didn't interest him, but Roger wasn't interested in anyone else's musical tastes. Dave admitted he finally stopped trying to contribute to the album and said "if you need a guitar player, give me a call and I'll come and do it."

Roger. The guy who doesn't listen to other people's records and isn't interested in playing musical instruments.

That's who was in charge of the music? No wonder it was wildly unpopular.
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space triangle
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by space triangle »

'Remember A Day' was originally written and intended to be on the TPatGoD album. But, the song found his place first on the ASoS album. Maybe Syd wasn't so fabulous and nice too, and actually didn't let Rick's song to be on the Piper? 8)
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:27 pm 'Remember A Day' was originally written and intended to be on the TPatGoD album. But, the song found his place first on the ASoS album. Maybe Syd wasn't so fabulous and nice too, and actually didn't let Rick's song to be on the Piper? 8)
I'm not sure I understand how this relates to the previous discussion. Could you please explain?
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by ZiggyZipgun »

Annoying Twit wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:39 pm
space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:27 pm 'Remember A Day' was originally written and intended to be on the TPatGoD album. But, the song found his place first on the ASoS album. Maybe Syd wasn't so fabulous and nice too, and actually didn't let Rick's song to be on the Piper? 8)
I'm not sure I understand how this relates to the previous discussion. Could you please explain?
He's just making baseless speculations to try to make Roger not look like an asshole.

And it's much more likely that Rick wasn't happy with it, and didn't put it out until they needed to fill up their second album.

"I cringe at some of my songs - such as 'Remember A Day'."
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space triangle
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by space triangle »

ZiggyZipgun wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:44 pmHe's just making baseless speculations to try to make Roger not look like an asshole.
It's not baseless. Remember A Day was originally written to be on PATGOD. Why it was left out is never fully explained. You Ziggy obviously can't stand Roger Waters. I don't know what you're doing on the Pink Floyd forum then?
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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space triangle wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:27 pmMaybe Syd wasn't so fabulous and nice too, and actually didn't let Rick's song to be on the Piper? 8)
Interesting that Rick went on to produce Barrett, playing organ, piano, electric piano, and harmonium across 10 of the 12 tracks.

"I was self-taught and my only group was Pink Floyd. I was not featured on 'Corporal Clegg' but did play on another track written by Richard Wright - I forget the title but it had a steel guitar in the background. There have been complications regarding the LP but it is now almost finished and should be issued by EMI in a few months. I now spend most of my time writing." - Syd, 1968

What a prick!
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by ZiggyZipgun »

Also, they didn't finish recording it until two months after Piper came out.
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space triangle
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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ZiggyZipgun wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:10 pmInteresting that Rick went on to produce Barrett,
They first kicked Syd out of the band, and then they produced his solo albums The Madcap Laughs and Barett. I'm trying to imagine a situation in which David, Rick and Nick produce Roger's solo albums Radio KAOS and Amused To Death after a conflict 1985/1986. :D
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

Post by Kerry King »

Annoying Twit wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:44 am
Kerry King wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:35 am Kurt Loder, in his widely circulated review, said it was essentially a Waters solo album.
Is there anyone who disagrees that it's essentially a Waters solo album?
It's totally obvious. I only mentioned it in response to this...
ZiggyZipgun wrote: Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:50 pm
space triangle wrote: Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:30 pmWhen The Final Cut was released, it quickly spreads rumours the album is quite a weak. And also that the album was actually more like Roger Waters' solo album, and not Pink Floyd at all.
WTF, mate?

Rolling Stone's Kurt Loder gave it five stars when it came out, opening his review with "This may be art rock’s crowning masterpiece..." ...Many other publications did give it less flattering reviews, but none of them were as widely circulated as Rolling Stone... But to say that "rumors" deterred Pink Floyd fans - particularly all of those many, many people that bought copies of The Wall - on the grounds that it was really a Roger Waters solo album, is especially far-fetched considering how many of them didn't know who he was,
It's not far fetched to believe that word of mouth hurt the album sales. Or the fact that it was dominated by Waters. And if you bought the final cut not knowing who Roger Waters was all you had to do was read the back cover of the album to figure it out.
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Re: Pink Floyd - The Wall

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