No Roger No Floyd!!

General discussion about Pink Floyd.
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EarlsFloyd
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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by EarlsFloyd » Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:43 pm

flashback wrote:
Wed Dec 19, 2018 1:39 pm
hey I'm calm.Was pointing out PF was not Roger or Syd or any 1 member.It was a collection of all it's members.They all brought something to the table in some form,be it lyrics or music.PF was greater than the sum of it's parts.
lol, ok i know i made mistakes in the message

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by Hadrian » Thu Dec 20, 2018 4:54 pm

moom wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:35 am
On An Island tour
That one was for me his best solo tour so far (I count on another studio album and another small tour by Gilmour in the future, very likely his last).

At the beginning of the tour On an Island album made up the entire first set (Pink Floyd stuff was the second set, plus the encore), and the whole album was originally played in order. That was a wonderful way to experience his entire new album first, and then dive into Pink Floyd era. Beyond hearing the whole new album live, the other gem of that tour was the live rendition of "Echoes", which was always closing the second set. Gilmour and Wright did a spectacular job there, the released live version is the best sounding one ever (if only one could remove the audience, it would be even better). They tried "Echoes" in 1987, but Gilmour was not happy with the result (although Guy Pratt's Level 42-like slapping bass on it makes the version unique, it can be heard on bootlegs).

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by snifferdog » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:03 am

I don't see it as "No Floyd" but as a diminished version of it. I consider "The Wall" to be the last proper Pink Floyd album. While "The Final Cut" has its moments, it's basically a Roger Waters solo album with a backing band that happens to contain David and Nick. It's debatable what Rick would have added to the mix at that stage even if he hadn't been ejected from the band.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by Hadrian » Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:23 pm

I have a theory that things might have turned out differently had Waters decided to switch things around somewhat after The Wall, and do The Pros and Cons of Hitch Hiking as a Pink Floyd album in 1983 - and follow that with The Final Cut as his solo album in 1984.

We know very well that The Pros and Cons of Hitch Hiking had been around since 1978, that Waters presented the project to the band concurrently with The Wall (and the band selected the latter for the next record at that time). Making it happen in 1983 was doable.

But more importantly, unlike The Final Cut which is both highly political and very Waters-personal, The Pros and Cons of Hitch Hiking is thematically very Pink Floyd. Gilmour (and Mason) would not have objected to the material itself, which means far less tensions in the studio and in general. Perhaps even the stage show might have happened if the recording turned out to be a smooth sailing. Who knows what might have happened afterwards, but there was definitely a chance of a longer three man Floyd there.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by theaussiefloydian » Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:19 pm

The idea that Floyd wasn't Floyd without Waters strikes me as sheer nonsense. If somebody leveled that accusation at Pink Floyd in 1987 I would see the merit in the argument, given that AMLoR was, shall we say, not very Floydian (but there are reasons for that, and I will maintain that it is exactly what it is - a David Gilmour record reworked to be a Floyd album at the studio's behest.)
But the thing is what I love about Pink Floyd isn't just Waters' lyrics - they are simply part of the whole. Wish You Were Here is my favourite Pink Floyd record, because to me that captures Pink Floyd at perfect equilibrium, a beautiful balance between Water's lyricism and general leadership (before he became something of a dictator in The Wall and The Final Cut) and the outstanding musicmanship of Gilmour, Wright and Mason. Together as a unit they were all Pink Floyd - no one person was Pink Floyd. When Waters left, sure they lost a part of them. But to quote R.E.M. when Bill Berry quit, "a dog with three legs is still a dog, we just have to learn how to run differently." It took Gilmour, Wright and Mason to find their feet, but The Division Bell is, whilst not as outstanding as Wish You Were Here or Dark Side of the Moon, still a hell of a good record, and was my favourite Floyd through most of my high school years. They were still definitely Pink Floyd, just a little different. And you know what, bands change and evolve. If that weren't the case Radiohead for example would have been a forgotten grunge band, and Pink Floyd would have been a curiosity of the psychedelic era.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by cheapfilm » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:30 am

Pink Floyd is Nick's band in March!!!!!!!

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by twcc » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:42 am

cheapfilm wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:30 am
Pink Floyd is Nick's band in March!!!!!!!
Nick has been carrying the flag every since he started touring the early stuff in May 2018. However, he has made it clear that the Saucers are not Pink Floyd ... :)

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by nonesuch » Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:58 pm

Ah, that discussion again.

Let's see what Pink Floyd would have been missing, if there never had been a Roger Waters:

1. No excellent lyrics in „Echoes“
2. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on „Dark Side“, there would not have been „Money“, which broke the band in the US, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
3. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on WYWH, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
4. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on Animals, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
5. There would not have been The Wall.
6. There would not have been the excellent Final Cut.

Wet Dream had been pathetic, the first Gilmour album would not have made a proper Pink Floyd-album. Thus, it would have been up to Nick Mason to come up with concepts, lyrics and much of the music for the aforementioned albums. Or Ginger Gilmour would have been forced to come up with some lyrics. Or, maybe, Kate Bush would have been forced to play the Bass, join Pink Floyd and write lyrics.

Lapse and Divison showed that the band had lost its creative force and heart.
Those years had been dictated by Gilmour's ego, but certainly not by his creative hunger, because there was none of that left anymore. He went on to become fat and bored. And he had lost any sense of taste. A reggae-version of Money, anyone?

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by twcc » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:39 am

nonesuch wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:58 pm
...
6. There would not have been the excellent Final Cut.
Provocative
nonesuch wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:58 pm
... A reggae-version of Money, anyone?
It's been done, see the track by Gary "Nesta" Pine & Dollarman on the rather eccentric 'Dub Side of The Moon' by the Easy Star All-Stars (love the break around the 3-minute mark)

<ii>

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by nonesuch » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:22 pm

twcc wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:39 am
nonesuch wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:58 pm
...
6. There would not have been the excellent Final Cut.
Provocative
nonesuch wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:58 pm
... A reggae-version of Money, anyone?
It's been done, see the track by Gary "Nesta" Pine & Dollarman on the rather eccentric 'Dub Side of The Moon' by the Easy Star All-Stars (love the break around the 3-minute mark)

<ii>
Provocation is my middle name.

It's been done even more awfully by the Gilmour-led entourage euphemistically called Pink Floyd around 1987/1988.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by azza200 » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:57 pm

pathetic people bashing the post waters floyd and discrediting the others input over the years. Just because Davd, Rick, didnt get credits on those albums does not mean they were lazy it was because Roger took all credit for it. Some peoples obsession of posting anti gilmour hate is really sad. The fact they think Pink Floyd is just Roger Waters are pathetic.
Ah, that discussion again.

Let's see what Pink Floyd would have been missing, if there never had been a Roger Waters:

1. No excellent lyrics in „Echoes“
2. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on „Dark Side“, there would not have been „Money“, which broke the band in the US, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
3. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on WYWH, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
4. Gilmour would have had nothing to sing on Animals, the overall concept of that album would just not have existed.
5. There would not have been The Wall.
6. There would not have been the excellent Final Cut.

Wet Dream had been pathetic, the first Gilmour album would not have made a proper Pink Floyd-album. Thus, it would have been up to Nick Mason to come up with concepts, lyrics and much of the music for the aforementioned albums. Or Ginger Gilmour would have been forced to come up with some lyrics. Or, maybe, Kate Bush would have been forced to play the Bass, join Pink Floyd and write lyrics.

Lapse and Divison showed that the band had lost its creative force and heart.
Those years had been dictated by Gilmour's ego, but certainly not by his creative hunger, because there was none of that left anymore. He went on to become fat and bored. And he had lost any sense of taste. A reggae-version of Money, anyone?
Echoes is a group effort with Rick and the famous ping there would be no Echoes its not Roger who thought of that.
The Final Cut a Roger Waters solo album all but in name. The band all hated each other at this point as Roger was in full dictator ego trip mode
The Wall the band hated each other as well the biggest hits were collabs with David & Comfortably Numb was originally going to be a solo song by David
The band toured early versions of Sheep, and Dogs in 1974-75 David Rick had input in the song not solely Roger like you claim.
Dark side is again a Band effort with them all working together watch Classic Album's Dark Side Documentary you may learn some things.

Gilmours ego LOL what for continuing the band which he had a right do like any other band does when a member decides to leave. The only person who had the ego at that time was Roger.

Shame this forum has become a negative anti gilmour forum no wonder no one posts here much because of topics and comments like this. The fact people still have severe hatred towards David to this day is very sad and pathetic. Why not just enjoy the music of all era's saying its not Pink Floyd is laughable so its not Pink Floyd when Syd was not around. David has stated many times he is NOT a strong Songwriter which he makes up with his music ability and how he expresses himself thru the guitar.

AMLOR was a difficult album because of all the legal issues created by Roger & the record company wanted a new album. Its not the best Floyd album but it does have some good songs on it which have become classics On The Turning Away Sorrow, Learning To Fly

The Division Bell is also more of a group effort since Wish You Were Here

Slating David for his weight is rather disgusting and is boarder line Bullying to some extent. Slating his wife very childish and pathetic
Last edited by azza200 on Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:23 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by twcc » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:01 pm

^^^
Agreed, let's please keep ON TOPIC and less of the bashing.

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by theaussiefloydian » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:06 pm

azza200 wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:57 pm
Slating David for his weight is rather disgusting and is boarder line Bullying to some extent. Slating his wife very childish and pathetic
I agree with you, azza. Personal attacks are just gross at the worst and unnecessary at best. You can dislike someone's music without being nasty to them.
I honestly think we all need to take a large sized chill pill and just chill out. Typing a rage letter at people because they like/dislike a thing isn't going to do much for discourse, after all.
Last edited by twcc on Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: EDIT by twcc to remove OFF TOPIC comment

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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by flashback » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:55 pm

I'll say it 1 more time for those that didn't hear me the 100 times before,PF was greater than the sum of it's parts.No 1 person was PF,enough said.

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theaussiefloydian
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Re: No Roger No Floyd!!

Post by theaussiefloydian » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:04 pm

flashback wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:55 pm
No 1 person was PF,enough said.
Amen to that!