"Saucerful" on CD - defective??

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TheLazenby
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"Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by TheLazenby » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:12 am

Has anyone heard about the 1994 remaster of "A Saucerful Of Secrets" being defective? I've always thought mine was...

There's a jump in "Set The Controls", clicks in "Saucerful", and really weird mixing in "See Saw" where the stereo channels suddenly switch with a click. I thought I just had a bad disc, but I randomly downloaded the album as a FLAC, and it had the same issues.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by jmr » Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:55 pm

I've never noticed it on my copy; but it's been a while since I've listened to it. I'll give it a spin tonight to see if I notice anything odd.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by Machiner83 » Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:22 am

The jump on Set The Controls is even in my Saucerful cd, but it's not on WORKS cd. Don't remember about See-Saw at the moment. I have to add that Remember A Day sounds better on RELICS cd than in Saucerful one. Definetly this album needs a re-remaster.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by cymbaline212 » Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:32 am

don't worry. 2018 is just around the corner.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by danielcaux » Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:23 pm

Has anyone checked if this issues are also present on the original 80s "non-remastered" CDs?

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by TheLazenby » Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:58 pm

What about the disc in "Oh By The Way"? Is that sourced from the 1994 version?

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by my breakfast. » Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:37 pm

There is certainly an odd edit in Set the Controls where the organ and bass/drums skip channels as if a completely different section was editted in. The mixing on that album is really strange tbh, Set the Controls seems to keep blooming out into the stereo field and there are odd drones that are barely audible in Remember a Day. See Saw is certainly editted together from different takes, with Ricks bombastic Mellotron chords clearly the work of some devious tape splicing action. They seem to jump out of nowhere!

This album always threw me a bit. Its like it has the ghost of Syd jammed in there somehow. Little tinkles and drones and general oddness, and inpenetrable artwork as well. Its like the dark version of Piper. The title track also kickstarted the whole Krautrock and ambient movement! Sheesh.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by crowman » Fri Oct 02, 2009 10:05 am

danielcaux wrote:Has anyone checked if this issues are also present on the original 80s "non-remastered" CDs?
I don't know where my 80s version is, but I seem to remember noticing the same jump in that version too. I remember hoping that the 94 remaster would fix it up, and being disappointed when it didn't. I think I remember it anyway, it's been a while. It could just be an original tape edit (which raises the possibility of an extended version, not that it would ever get released :( ). I'll see if I can find my old version and have another listen.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by moom » Fri Oct 02, 2009 11:52 am

I have a couple of clicks in Controls, sorry can't be bothered to look for the CD to look up the year.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by TheLazenby » Sat Oct 03, 2009 12:48 am

Is that glitch on the original LP??

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by Machiner83 » Sat Oct 03, 2009 1:06 am

crowman wrote:It could just be an original tape edit (which raises the possibility of an extended version, not that it would ever get released :( ).
Listen to the WORKS cd source. No jump there, so no extended versions around OR a better edit made for that compilation.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by moom » Sat Oct 03, 2009 8:09 am

TheLazenby wrote:Is that glitch on the original LP??
If you're asking me, then I dunno, I have a CD.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by my breakfast. » Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:57 pm

Listened to my version and the clicks are NOT artifacts added digitally. Its clicking drum sticks or possibly microphones being tapped by accident. A similar effect happens in Strange Days by The Doors where Densmore accidentally hits the close mics on his toms.

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by zag » Sat Oct 03, 2009 4:34 pm

TheLazenby wrote:Is that glitch on the original LP??
Mine is full of them already :lol:

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Re: "Saucerful" on CD - defective??

Post by crowman » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:31 pm

I've had a closer listen and there is indeed a crude edit in the Saucerful version of Set the Controls that is not present in the Works version. The glitch occurs around the 2:30 mark. The volume, particularly that of the organ, jumps noticeably (about 5 decibels) and there seems to be a slight glitch in the rhythm. At 2:35 the volume drops back to where it was, with another slight glitch in the rhythm. The Works version doesn't exhibit this variation nor does the Echoes compilation.

Examining the Saucerful and Works versions side by side in Pro Tools, the change becomes more apparent. The two versions are basically the same, save for the Works version being quieter and marginally faster, due to the natural variation of the different tape machines they were played back on. At the 2:30 point the two versions become markedly different, before reverting back to sync at 2:35.

Closer inspection of the Saucerful version is interesting. The 5 second section that jumps in volume contains a brief organ phrase (the notes B--A-F-E, played in a daaa-da-DA-da rhythm). This phrase is repeated immediately after the 2:35 mark, but at a lower volume. Taking the 2:30-2:35 section and lining it up directly with the 2:35-2:40 section shows that they are identical, apart from from the difference in volume. 5 seconds of audio from 2:35 has been duplicated, boosted in volume and slotted in at 2:30, in place of the original audio which remains intact on the Works version. I have no idea why this might have occurred, perhaps a dodgy edit was done to the master tape somewhere along the line. Thankfully it seems to have been restored on the Echoes version.

(Edit: miscalculated the volume difference, now changed to 5dB)
Last edited by crowman on Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.