Lord Bryon wrote: I don't expect a PERFECT show...but that's what Waters wants to give...and it's his perogative.
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i attended his concert at the members equity stadium in perth western australia and it was far from perfect IMHO.
if his reason for lip-syncing was to provide a better experience he failed on that night.
i couldn't tell if he was lips-syncing anyway as i was a long way from the stage. i guess if i had noticed i would have been even more disappointed with the performance. i guess as long as its still his performance and he isn't lip-syncing to someone else's performance its better than no performance at all.
there are a lot of other tricks used to make a performance live sound better anyway such as using a shadow band or another singer filling for you in the background to boost your own weak vocals as well as various on board mixer tricks.
if you were all serious about the purity of the performance then a concert would be one man and a guitar with no amplification - which might not work terribly well at a larger venue than - say my living room.
Vlad The Impaler wrote:
Whine? Don't think so..that's a pretty weak conclusion...you over-state yourself...I merely made an opinion...which still stands. I've seen Waters three times on his last tour when he wasn't lip-synching....I'll stick with that for memory purposes. If other people don't care and still wanna go it's no skin off my nose...feel free by all means...enjoy...treasure....but if I don't share the same opinion...oh well....you'll get over it eventually.
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I just wanted to make clear that (I thought) you were acting consequently . Exaggerating leads to reactions...
filthyfish wrote:You should all know my opinion on the who subject so I am not going to get into that again.
You have voiced you're opinion about this before, and I for one share it, but this might be a good time to present it clearly without the heat of argument, so as to finally lay this chestnut to rest.
Lord Bryon wrote:1. For those that say that Roger did NOT lip sync during the tour, what videos or tapes are you basing this judgment on? I don't think saying, "I saw him live and he definitely wasn't lip syncing..." counts. With the amount of crowd noise and distance from the stage, how could you say that?
So, filthyfish ^^^ is offering evidence which does seem worth counting imo, even though it doesn't rely on tapes/vids. And anyway are tapes/videos reliable on their own - if you don't know how the recording was done?
Lord Bryon wrote:
"yes, we all love Rog...which makes this even sadder...
Waters might as well just put that Pink dummy on stage with his black clothes, black P-bass and his Wall face mask, he doesn't have to sing (tapes for that) or even play his bass well (Andy will cover for him)...he can phone it in night after night while he puts $1M in his pocket when he goes back to his 5 star hotel and a permanent crowd of suck ups bow and scrape at his feet...
David Gilmour & Rick Wright can go out and play what could pass as a latter day Floyd show, on the other hand, Waters solo band sounds like a tribute band with a bad lead singer...Graham Broad is horrible at playing ALL FLOYD songs (hammering away on his ride like an ass), if Carin and that Kilminster weren't on this tour, his shows would a complete joke. Snowy is great, but he has his own distinct style and isn't great at copying Gilmour's crafted solos and trademark bends...Kilminster plays Gilmour very well, as does Carin covering Wright.
The question is: Why is Waters touring anyway? Why is the super genius mastermind teaming up with Howard Shore & Ennio Morricone to get new songs written ?
Waters is going out like the egomaniac he really is...he can talk the talk (barely), but his walk is gone...presales to AmEx members, and he's charging outrageous sums for this poor live peformance...don't forget that he mentioned his "rock" album release 7 years ago !
Where is it ? Why can't he release all of this music that he recorded with Doyle and Snowy and the others back in '99/'00 ???? It's ridiculous for him to tour with no new music and no voice...I think his fans have given him far too much slack just because of his past.
Gilmour has upheld the ideals that Waters used to stand for, and Waters has become the worm in the limo on the way to the jackbooted rally, with idiot fans flashing hammers at him on cue, that was cool back in '99 when he hadn't toured in 12 years...now it's just old and played out, and as a fan, I can't even listen to shows from this tour because you can hear the vocal tapes...and can't distinguish one from the other...
I can't think of one major rock artist that uses tapes for lead vocals, not one, except for you know who...and it's just sad that he just wants to stand up on a stage and play "rock star"...it's nearly a laugh, but really a cry...
you think Gilmour would even walk on a stage if he couldn't sing ??"
what a sad angry idiot.... seems like an angry kid who couldn´t afford the ticket and is pissed off
you think Gilmour would even walk on a stage if he couldn't sing ?
listen to his performance of On the turning away in Venice 2006. I WISH he would have used prerecorded stuff instead of this embarrasing perfomance... (or he could at least have looked at the lyrics before...)
Freddie Mercury wrote:I don't really recall Roger ever coming out and saying anything against lip-syncing (like Elton John has), though I could be wrong. A zillion tapes were used on The Wall shows and then actually released as an official CD, yet no one complained about that.
The Wall shows in 1980, Roger sang live in accompanyment to his voice on Bring the Boys. The rest was all live. DG's vocals were all live.
Does it not annoy people that musicians use MIDI interfaces instead of real orchestras for live shows? Don't you want to see violins? Isn't that a better live show? You see Paul McCartney live these days, and he plays Penny Lane, do you want to see horns playing the horn parts? Live horns sound nasty compared to a digital reproduction (smoothed out and processed) and who says Roger Waters will sing in tune (why break the habit of a lifetime? ). You see my point? People get touchy about paying to see a "live" performance, but half the instruments aren't real!
Also, do we eliminate a click track? If they are really good musicians they don't need a tempo set out to them surely? These are things we don't mind, so whats wrong with a little syncho?
ESLAFTK2112 wrote:
The Wall shows in 1980, Roger sang live in accompanyment to his voice on Bring the Boys. The rest was all live. DG's vocals were all live.
"Is There Anybody Out There" did not become live until Gilmour started playing the guitar part. Prior to that, it was the tape.
ESLAFTK2112 wrote:
The Wall shows in 1980, Roger sang live in accompanyment to his voice on Bring the Boys. The rest was all live. DG's vocals were all live.
"Is There Anybody Out There" did not become live until Gilmour started playing the guitar part. Prior to that, it was the tape.
There are a LOT of tapes in the 1980 Wall shows.
Sound effects tapes are one thing, I can tolerate things like pre-recorded sound effects, pre-recorded music sans the vocal track (Queen, Rush, Styx and Genesis had done it) but LIP SYNCHING a pre-recorded vocal track is a WHOLE OTHER STORY. I heard Rick and Peter Wood add a synth to ITAOT on The Wall Rehearsals ROIO. Majority of The Wall shows were sung LIVE save ITAOT. Roger sang with himself on BtBBH on ITAOT. Synthesizers have developed where they can re-create orchestras, horn sections and other things. Back in the 1960s, and the 1970s until things like Mellotron and the Polymoog and the ARP String Ensemble came around, recreating things were tough. ELP brought an orchestra on tour and look what happened, disaster.
Vlad The Impaler wrote:Brittany Spears and others of her ilk lip-synch and get criticized big-time....Roger does it and many of the same people wanna forgive it. Makes no sense. One pays their money to see and hear a performer perform live...not pretend to a record...I don't care who the name is...no exceptions. Roger waters or not...if he's faking it...I ain't goin'. IMO.
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Britney, or as I call her (an obscenity which rhymes with Witchney), had a lip-syncher's worst nightmare during her club tour this past year. Her vocal track skipped LOL! Ashlee Simpson lip synched on SNL, got busted and was booed by 72,000 people when she did sing LIVE!
Ronnie James Dio is older than Roger but still has his vocal range and sings live every night. Roger Daltrey still had it when I saw The Who live last year. Rush still have it. Queen usually played the opera section of Bohemian Rhapsody when the song was played live.
I didn't even think I'd see the day where David Coverdale's pipes have aged better than Robert Plant.
nosaj wrote:When I saw Roger in Toronto in September 2006, the video screen revealed he was lip-synching...a potential free ticket was mine in July, but I declined in the end...and the only reason I would have gone was to see the lazer pyramid.
I left during Us and Them as I was on the lawn seats in WPB and a severe thunderstorm came our way. My dad, God bless him, said "Terrence, I don't want to ruin it but a thunderstorm is coming and I don't want you to get struck by lightning" and I agreed as I had to open the record store the next day. Looks like I didn't miss much. Plus, I have Cork, Ireland on VHS so I saw what I missed. When I saw Roger in 2000, he was running on all cylinders. This go around, he looked like he went through the motions IMHO!
ESLAFTK2112 wrote:Sound effects tapes are one thing, I can tolerate things like pre-recorded sound effects, pre-recorded music sans the vocal track (Queen, Rush, Styx and Genesis had done it) but LIP SYNCHING a pre-recorded vocal track is a WHOLE OTHER STORY.
This is very much your (triple posting troll) opinion, and you haven't justified it in any of your three posts. But... you do have ANOTHER crack at Britney Spears where it isn't necessary.
). You see my point? People get touchy about paying to see a "live" performance, but half the instruments aren't real!