Sympathy for Roger Waters?

radiowaves · Post by **radiowaves** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:11 pm

I was just looking at the 'Behind The Wall' DVD, and i felt really sorry for Roger. He said that he would rather not speak about the sacking of Rick because his therapist told him so. Everyone else in the band agreed that Roger was going through a tough time in his life during 'The Wall'.

I know where Roger is coming from by making this saying, and i can't help but feel for him. He lost a lot of fans both by the 'sacking' of Rick,and the subsequent court case over the bands name.

Would anyone care to comment on this? As i'm sitting here pondering my love of Roger's music over the latter Pink Floyd.

edit: Edited the thread title, the guy's name for a title is way too general - saucerfulofmeddle

Post by **Keith Jordan** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:13 pm

Roger was and still is a violently obsessive and posessive man. Very difficult to work with I would imagine. I dont feel sorry for him as I dont know him. I do think he got carried away with his delusions of grandeur though!! Great songs though!

DoctorFloyd · Post by **DoctorFloyd** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:17 pm

Yeah my opinion has certainly changed of him. It started when I read Q magasine special, and thought 'What a &?@%!" and didn't blame David for disliking him. It has to be said, I wouldn't have said he handled the situation that well, but maybe the others didn't either.

But my opinion has changed somewhat, to the point where I think now David is maybe the more stubborn of the two, and I feel sorry for Roger for losing what he had with the other members of Pink Floyd and with the fans.

I think that other things, like Dave working on his solo album and not having any material for the band, likewise with Rick, also had an effect on the course that the band took. I doubt very much that the split would have happened if they had all come into the studio with some new ideas and worked on them, instead of creating The Wall, essentially only Rogers idea, and then the rest being forced to think of ideas for it - and him feeling quite so possesive over the whole thing. So its certainly not just roger to blame.

radiowaves · Post by **radiowaves** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 12:07 am

I can certainly feel that Roger took the group to its curent glory. At live 8, he proved his worth of being a very caring man. His line up for his shows also proves that long term stalwarts such as Snowy White and Andy Fairweather- Low goes to show that he can still pull allegiance with musical might. Did David give up his dislike for Roger For Live 8? and did the appearence of Nick at one of Roger's London shows say that all rifts have healed?

Roger is a very learned man. So is David. We hear a lot about David because of the release of 'On An Island'. But we canot forget the monumental effect 'Ca Ira' had on the impact of Pink Floyd Fans. It is a fantastic piece of work, and one not to be taken lightly.

As a classical listener myself, and a Pink Floyd/Roger fan, I feel Ca Ira is a very important piece of musiacal history for all Pink Floyd fans.

Roger is a very important song writer. His words echoe his thoughts. And that is rare.

Tenniru · Post by **Tenniru** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:41 am

I often do feel pretty bad for him. He became an artist with a complete, finished version of what he wanted; and when you combine that with any protectiveness of your music than you become Roger Waters during the Wall era. Finally he got fed up with trying to deal with other musicians trying to add "ideas" to his work and just left. He wound up with Pros And Cons, something he was satisfied with; but something went wrong and he realized that just because he was the main lyrical force didn't mean he could be Pink. Then, suddenly, the other three went on tour without him, playing his songs, his lyrics (a lot of which were very personal), and making huge amount of money off of it. And really, a lot of the indignity of Scott Page must've driven him mad.

So he tries to defend himself by suing. He loses. Then, to add injury to insult, Pink Floyd decides to jump into action RIGHT as he's starting a solo tour. A band that wouldn't be what it was without him had just turned on him and murdered Radio KAOS; one of the greatest stage show ideas ever. Then the tour was aborted halfway through and KAOS died.
I can understand why he got angry.

Then, it's 1992. Despite David Gilmour's immature "oh, we got of old misery guts" comments (don't you just want to PUNCH him?), he gets to work rather silently. However, from what I can imagine, the humiliation of the failed Pros And Cons and KAOS tours combined with the fact that you have to be REALLY depressed after making Amused To Death, he winds up not immediately touring and gets some psychiatric help.
The moment he comes out, Pink Floyd starts barreling around the world. Now he's forced to sit back and WATCH; accepting you don't have a hope against competing against the guys who stole your art from you can't be painless.

Yes, I do feel bad for Roger sometimes. It must've taken maturity to the extreme to keep himself from going on a Lennon 1970 Rolling Stone rant.

Post by **mosespa** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:56 am

I have a certain sympathy for Roger:

At a time when no one else was doing anything to keep Pink Floyd alive, he rose to the challenge and guided the band through several quality albums.

Then...just as they got more successful than ever before, he was being accused of megalomania.

Simply because he was taking up the tasks that no one else would.

Now...when he declared Pink Floyd "over" because he left...well...that seemed to verify the accusations levered against him.

BUT...again...if it wasn't for Roger Waters, we'd have no DSOTM, no WYWH, no Animals, no The Wall and no The Final Cut.

So, I think that to a certain extent, he was justified in his delusions of grandeur.

On the other hand, he began to cast out the people who helped him realize his vision one by one.

Having said that, I STILL think that Waters' solo albums are more Floydian in spirit than anything the band did without him.

So, yeah...I sympathize with the guy.

iwantmypinkfloydnow · Post by **iwantmypinkfloydnow** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:00 am

mosespa wrote:I have a certain sympathy for Roger:

At a time when no one else was doing anything to keep Pink Floyd alive, he rose to the challenge and guided the band through several quality albums.

Then...just as they got more successful than ever before, he was being accused of megalomania.

Simply because he was taking up the tasks that no one else would.

Now...when he declared Pink Floyd "over" because he left...well...that seemed to verify the accusations levered against him.

BUT...again...if it wasn't for Roger Waters, we'd have no DSOTM, no WYWH, no Animals, no The Wall and no The Final Cut.

So, I think that to a certain extent, he was justified in his delusions of grandeur.

On the other hand, he began to cast out the people who helped him realize his vision one by one.

Having said that, I STILL think that Waters' solo albums are more Floydian in spirit than anything the band did without him.

So, yeah...I sympathize with the guy.

So Roger is Floyd?

Post by **mosespa** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:02 am

iwantmypinkfloydnow wrote:
So Roger is Floyd?

No...

I've stated this before:

Roger is PINK...

Everyone ELSE is "Floyd."

At least, that's my OPINION...and I'm welcome to it

flashback · Post by **flashback** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:06 am

I don't feel sympathy for him Dave or the rest.They have had/chose fame,fortune,and everything that it brings.He didn't do anything he didn't want to.Even his leaving P-F was his choice.He failed to see 1 think and that was he was not P-F.Yes he wrote most of the stuff from DSOTM on.He failed to see that P-F was a band that it's members each on thier own was ok at best but when put together they became the greatest(IMHO)band ever.Sad when you think about it really but I don't feel sympathy for him or any of them.

The Gunner's Dream · Post by **The Gunner's Dream** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:21 am

I have trouble feeling sorry for any famous and successful musician

iwantmypinkfloydnow · Post by **iwantmypinkfloydnow** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:40 am

mosespa wrote:
iwantmypinkfloydnow wrote:
So Roger is Floyd?
No...

I've stated this before:

Roger is PINK...

Everyone ELSE is "Floyd."

At least, that's my OPINION...and I'm welcome to it

Gilmour is Pink, he's soft (listen to his voice and music!)

Roger is rugged and tough, he's got to be Floyd!

Well that's my opinion.

The Gunner's Dream · Post by **The Gunner's Dream** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:42 am

Wait a second, fellas. I thought Roger was "Mr. Pink Floyd"

flashback · Post by **flashback** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:46 am

The Gunner's Dream wrote:Wait a second, fellas. I thought Roger was "Mr. Pink Floyd"

At least that's what Roger said

iwantmypinkfloydnow · Post by **iwantmypinkfloydnow** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:49 am

Is there really anything "Pink" about Roger? Has he ever made a calming album, like David made (compare On an Island and amused to death or Cai Ira)?

The Gunner's Dream · Post by **The Gunner's Dream** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:51 am

What's not calming about Amused to death, or The Final Cut, for that matter. Just cause it's depressing doesnt mean it can't mellow you out.