To Tommy

David Smith · Post by **David Smith** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 7:32 pm

Tommy, a question for you:

Are American teenagers in any way like they're steriotyped to be. You know, niave self obsessed spoilt brats. Is this is any way a true portrail of them, as seen in movies like She's All That and Clueless.

Feeling Very Pink · Post by **Feeling Very Pink** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 9:12 pm

100% true.

Seriously, though, ditto.

Tommy · Post by **Tommy** » Sun Apr 06, 2003 11:45 pm

before i answer this, im gonna give a little background about myself. i go to a catholic high school and there are many many wealthy people there. kids drive BMWs, Mercedes, Porsches, you name it. austin is a relatively wealthy city because alot of technology is based there, such as Dell and other companies, and many Dell VIPs send their kids to my school, im friends with one of them. yes, many many american kids are correctly stereotyped, in fact, i overheard a freshman the other day "oh my god, i was so mad at my dad he was like 'i dont know if we're getting you the lexus' so i was like 'no way, get me the lexus!' i mean, they just dont know what theyre talking about, and like, i made my dad buy me a new cell phone last week..........." i mean, it went on and on, it was terrible. many of the kids are spoiled brats that get whatever they want, whether it be from parents or from school. if your a really good athlete at the school, you can get away with murder

my biggest problem with my school (my sophomore class especially) is the number of kids (girls mostly) that think theyre above everyone. they come off as people that are really nice, they make teachers think that way, but when you talk to them face to face, you realize "wow this girl is a b****"

so david, in answer to your question, i would say yes, american kids are as they are stereotyped, but that only covers the amount of kids i know. of course, i have many friends that go to public school and they tell me stories that are very similar. i wouldnt make you think worse of americans though, we're not all like this, like my friends for the most part are all good people and we try not to act too spoiled, even though, and ill admit, most of us are. the sheer fact that we go to a private school and our parents are wealthy makes us spoiled, but we dont rub it in other peoples faces, and trust me, there are much worse, like i said earlier

so david, what are scottish kids like?

just curious

SydsMadcapGirl · Post by **SydsMadcapGirl** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 1:54 am

Feeling Very Pink wrote:100% true.

Seriously, though, ditto.

I thought it was interesting how this type of query has come up several times in recent days, in my own experiences.

In all reality, most children are not raised with any culture. It's very sad, really. The majority of American teenagers, I'd say, are more influenced by Vin Diesel movies than their parents. The movie "The Fast and the Furios" spawned an entire subculture of 16-19 year old kids, who think they're hot stuff, meeting up every weekend and racing their Hondas and Mustangs. And how do these teenagers afford these cars? Well, Mommy and Daddy will buy them whatever they want, whatever gets them out of their hair anyway.

I honestly believe that the majority of American teenagers are shallow, self absorbed, and well, just plain obtuse. Even more so than when I was a teenager. I was never popular in school, never wanted to be popular in school, I preferred my little group of friends who'd rather get together and watch Kubrick films, than go see the latest Hollywood piece of crap Blockbuster.

But, see, it doesn't end with the teenagers. It had to start somewhere. Often times, the parents of said teens are too involved in their careers to be involved in their children's lives. Their children are often just trophies: "Sarah made straight A's this term", "Yeah, well my Andrew made captain of the football team". It's sad.

I have a 6 year old child myself. I put a lot of thought into parenting. Everything I do has a direct effect on my child...and so, there are many elements to be considered when raising him. His environment, the people he's around, the music he hears, the films he sees, the types of language he hears people use. I would much rather my son grows up using proper English, rather than phrases such as "I don't got any of those." Therefore, I must always use proper English when speaking to or around him. I want him to be cultured, artistic, to explore himself and what his interests are. So I make sure to offer up many different choices, and he seems to be pretty comfortable with making decisions regarding what he likes vs. what he doesn't. Even if it is something I don't necessarily like, doesn't mean it isn't good, or isn't something he doesn't like.

I say these things because, well, I think I'm a better parent than most are today. I think if everyone put consideration into the fact that their children are individuals, they wouldn't be influenced by crap movies like "The Fast and the Furious" and "She's All That".

::Stepping off soapbox.::

Stiggs · Post by **Stiggs** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 3:10 am

The way a kid is going to turn out I feel is determined almost 100% by how they were raised by their parents. If the parents are lazy, the kids are either going to grow up to be lazy, or they will never understand authority.
-I know of one family (the mom is the biggest, laziest bitch I've ever met in my life) who has 3 kids, one son of 5, and two daughters, 14 and 16. The son swears more than a sailor and won't stop breaking things. The 14 year old daughter is a 100-pound overweight kleptomaniac (she was caught stealing G-strings from a lingerie store....ewww) and will scream for whatever reason she feels is necessary. The 16 year old daughter is actually pretty of cool, but man is she stupid.
If the parents spoil their kids, then the kids will never learn about working to reach their goals. They want their parents to buy them stuff and they whine, gritch and moan until either the parents give in, or the kids have to work for themselves to get what they want and they hate their parents for it.
If the parents are jack asses, or really selfish, then chances are that their children will be too. Kids will think that they really are better than everyone else because the parents act that way. Those people I have no sympathy for.
Now for me, my parents were spoiling (I'm the baby of the family), yet authoritative. If I were good enough I would get something, but if I did something wrong I was either punished or we would sit down and talk. Good strategy. However, one thing I never liked about my parents is that for some lessons in life, they tried the scare tactics. You have sex before marriage, I'll kill ya (never really said that but it was to an extent), you do drugs I'll disown ya, stuff like that. I hated it because even tho I was like 12 or 13 or so I knew better than to believe scare tactics.

So in summary, it's unfortunate that the american teenagers are stereotyped to be bratty and stuck up and stuff. Really, they're not all bad apples, but there are plenty of rotten ones.

Tommy · Post by **Tommy** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 3:40 am

good point stiggs, alot of blame is put on kids, when alot should be put on parents, AKA the people blaming the kids. of course, you see commercials saying like kids of caring parents never drink or never do drugs, but that is not the case. i think the way kids act is based on parents and maybe even more on friends

Stiggs · Post by **Stiggs** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 3:53 am

A lot of the time kids are rebellious because their parents care....overparenting can also be bad to a child's mental health, it can cause anguish and resentment. If you've seen the movie "Traffic" you'd know what I talk about.

David Smith · Post by **David Smith** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 11:47 am

Tommy wrote:so david, what are scottish kids like? just curious

Scotish kids fall in to several categories, these categories are based upon the style the dress and the friends they have (for some reason people actully like categorising themselves) and here is the list:

Goths: Dress in black or dark, wear makeup often and hang around in large groups smoking pot. Few are intelligent, most are just wasters who base their image around failing at school and listen to hard rock bands to disguise their obvious insecurities. I actually knew someone who said "i'm turning gothic soon" and rather than naturally being a goth he came in the afew days later to school with baggy tousers e.t.c on and talked about satan. I would say these kids are just as people sterotype goths to be.

Chavs: Middle class kids who pretend to be working class. They have rich familes e.t.c but because they do badly at school they decide to dawn a baseball cap, threaten people and vandalise things so they look like rebels.

Student types: Hanging out at Starbucks, also i large groups thinking they're the upper crust of the young society. Each one of them a backstabber to the others and look down upon anyone who's not upper middle class like they're scum. The worst pf them are female.

Trend setters: Very loud people who act ladish (or like a ladette) in order to gain attention. They will also try and aquent themselves with EVERYONE so they look very popular. They normally skateboard to, or else wlak around in baggy clothes, although unlike goths they like to have a good time.

The others: i fall in to this category (since when he a kid in a pink floyd tshirt looked cool) and spend more time listening to music, playig pool and having proper conversations with people rather then debating trivial issues like who's got more of a chance with Britney Spears.

flashback · Post by **flashback** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 2:33 pm

David Smith,my son tells me they are goths over here,as well as preps(think they are better than anyone),stonners-name says it all.Then those that choose to go thier own way.

Pugs on the Wing · Post by **Pugs on the Wing** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 3:05 pm

Back in the stoneage when I went to school, there were the jocks (athletes and popular people who hung around with the athletes, the *richer* kids--no one was really *rich* in my high school), hicks (wore cowboy hats...it *was* Colorado, usually lived in the country or on a ranch), nerds (people who really got into academics...science and math in particular) and freaks (just about anyone else, but usually applied to the stoner kids). I was a freak, I guess because I didn't fit in the other categories and was a total music freak, even though my good grades could also apply to being a nerd, I didn't like the nerds and found them boring and disgusting. I didn't have a car in high school...definitely not jock-material.

Now, I live in an old, established neighborhood that would be classified as middle-class/lower middle-class economically, and left-of-center ideologically. It's a wonderful neighborhood and I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. My next door neighbor's teenagers are far from spoiled...they are great kids and well-behaved. They do not have their own cars. I live not too far from a high school and see lots of kids walking to school (not driving) or taking the city bus. But just outside my little humble working class yet educated and liberal paradise, there is "the west side" which has an abundance of spoiled brats. And there are gated communities in the suburbs. And there are also very depressing government-subsidized housing areas, however in Madison it's not as bad as in Milwaukee or Chicago.

I think that neighborhoods like mine are disappearing and being replaced by the extremes of the government subsidies and the gated communities. It's really sad how this divisiveness in our society is really affecting the kids who will be the most affected by it.

I agree with Syd'sMadcapGirl that so many people have kids for the status. It should be something you really want to do because you *love* kids, not because *everyone is doing it* or because some family member thinks that you should to be like everyone else. My husband and I decided a long time ago not to have kids just because we knew as artist-type people it would be very hard support them in our situation. I wish other people would reevaluate their reason for having kids...too many kids seem like status symbols and unwanted, in both poor and wealthy families. Ultimately, they pay the price.

Post by **Keith Jordan** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 3:23 pm

It is a funny thing growing up indeed! Even more funnier looking back at it. I am not sure if I can actually be saying this at 21. Perhaps I haven't "grown up" yet. It is funny seeing the divisions people create between groups of people when young. My college where I went to - not university you americans but the thing before university - was a perfect example. In the common room where everybody sat about waiting for/skipping classes there were divisions indeed.

There were the people who were good looking and therefore popular! Then there were their friends who, by default, were popular too! They didn't have to be attractive!! haha.

Then there were the nerdy types who were usually very intelligent, dressed like they didn't pay too much attention to fashion and were usually deformed or ugly in some way.

Then there was a majority of people who tried with their education, were pretty, reliable, smart and paid some attention to fashion and trends.

Then there was a certain type of people like me who were just generally nice people!! I talked to the nerds about my maths coursework, laughed at the people who thought they were super popular but got along with their friends, went out drinking beer at lunch time with the popular ones - if not just to laugh at them.

But saying that, everybody was really nice at my college as we were a very "tight" year. Lots of love for one another so I was lucky to know all those people from my life. A few idiots about but they were usually ignored and mocked.

David Smith · Post by **David Smith** » Mon Apr 07, 2003 4:57 pm

Of my experiences scotish and english kids are exactly the same, but i presumed Americans would be different seeing as you don't have the stiff english upper lip there, most of our entertainment is about humiliating our friends or abusing one another verbally or physically never once admitting to be proper friends. Ok, so most people have at least one proper friend nowadays who they don't do that to, but by and large we seem a lot more dysfunctional than Americans. This trend can be applied to any teenage group IMO and most adult ones to. Find your true friends and mock the rest 'cause they don't matter.

Anyway, yeah lifestyles and friendship groups are all very diverse, yet the one thing all countries share is divisions, i feel that are built up upon levels of ego. With arrogant cocky types causing problems for everyone else as a form of expression, or the ego can create a self obsession that results in wanting more and more (cause they deserve it, like those spoilt brats previously mentioned in this thread.) Self opinion can be a dangerous thing, although i feel it can be found that almost everyone who claims to be something isn't really, and it's only after they've claimed themselves gothic and lived the lifestyle that they're likely to look back at their time and think about what's happened to the once scared/ curious person they once were before a wall of ego built up other the years of which to retain they gave themselves their image.

Speaking for everyone of this forum (and if i'm wrong correct me) we're all a bit diffferent on this forum than we are in real life, possibally with our smart a*rse comments and put downs, and yet the reason we change is because on this forum we're never going to have to see anyone and it's fine to be overly confident, ths very psychology i feel can be applied to a lot of young people with the way they live their lives frequently looking for attention, many of them are just looking for someone to relate to, but they probably won't find them, so a few flings with some old dogs later and a drinks self analysis seems pointless, why find yourself in a world where nobody else does.

And personally i pity people who live like that and make something of themselves just to feel better, cause it won't work in the end. Being yourself is something people should do out of choice, not as a last resort. No matter how cocky people can be nobody is born like that and it's all in the mind, a mind that develops over the years. Watch your ego or you could become your own ideology, or even worse, someone elses.

All as Oscar Wilde tells it, only less funny.

Tommy · Post by **Tommy** » Wed Apr 09, 2003 3:58 am

hmmm, only one so called goth at my school that i can immedietly think of, and everyone knows shes not serious, shes just looking for attention. my public school friends tell me that there is alot of goths there who wear shirts that say "cant sleep clowns will eat me" from that simpsons episode

Feeling Very Pink · Post by **Feeling Very Pink** » Wed Apr 09, 2003 4:50 am

kjnpf wrote:we were a very "tight" year. Lots of love for one another so I was lucky to know all those people from my life. A few idiots about but they were usually ignored and mocked.

That's nice. I don't think I've ever been in a tight year... although I've seen them at close hand... I've always had tight friends, though...

Post by **Keith Jordan** » Wed Apr 09, 2003 12:43 pm

David Smith wrote:Speaking for everyone of this forum (and if i'm wrong correct me) we're all a bit diffferent on this forum than we are in real life, possibally with our smart a*rse comments and put downs, and yet the reason we change is because on this forum we're never going to have to see anyone and it's fine to be overly confident, ths very psychology i feel can be applied to a lot of young people with the way they live their lives frequently looking for attention, many of them are just looking for someone to relate to, but they probably won't find them, so a few flings with some old dogs later and a drinks self analysis seems pointless, why find yourself in a world where nobody else does.

I suppose being comfortable with yourself enables you to disengage your mind from thinking you are inferior to other people and, therefore, you come across as being "confident" or whatever. It takes beautiful people to appreciate beautiful things. It would seem from this logic that we can all be beautiful if only we believe it. Beauty that is by looks alone is shallow and natural. Right and wrong. Evil and... ooohhhh la la!!!

Just love people and treat them nice even when they are less than nice to you. Makes the world a better place for you. Would you rather be looking at beauty then nastiness? I know I would. People have histories and contexts. I suppose this determines which of these "groups" they fall into. Be they the quiet nerdy type or the top dogs. The leaders. Shame about those leaders who just need acceptance. If only they could learn to truly love themselves and see their inner beauty. See?

Life is for living and loving.

To Tommy

To Tommy

Good God! More 2 cents from Stiggs!